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GFCI Tripped...it could have been worse

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Bud, May 23, 2012.

  1. Bud Loves Bacon Website Team Board of Directors Leadership Team GIRS Member Vendor

    West Des Moines, IA
    Ratings:
    +1,823 / 14 / -0
    I got a call at 7:30 this morning from Grove & Platt that the system was shut down.  GFCI Breaker tripped at 7:00pm last night.
    All the fish were either dead or looking dead or at the surface.  By the time I got there 1/2 hour later, you wouldn't have known anything had happened actually, besides a few dead fish.  Lost the Flame Fin Tang (bummed) and Scopas Tang, the Yellow Tang was looking in pretty bad shape, had himself propped up (at 7:30 he was on his side with a dead shrimp sitting on him) and the Angel (from Dave, originally Sone's) was camped out behind the rockwork, looking rough, but he was up and swimming around after a little bit.  The Blue Tang, Engineer Goby, Green Chromis, and all 3 clowns are looking good.  All the corals look fine.
    Water tested clear for Ammonia, N, P...
    I found some salt deposits near the box for the outlets, and originally I figured that was the problem, some water snaked down the back of the tank and wicked along the stand and dripped on it.  Gotta fix that issue, but I don't think that was the problem.
    Also I will be switching the receptacle order so that the GFCI is downstream from the other outlet.
    I went to put a few things away and noticed the Reeflo pump did not sound quite right.  Kind of like a intermittent swishing sound.  Then I touched the pump - and almost burned myself.  I couldn't keep my hands on the fins for more than 1 second, and I can actually still feel it.  So after running for just over 2 hours, then thing is probably nearing thermal overload.
    I talked to Chris at Reeflo and he said that it's either a bad bearing (in which case they will send me a new pump) or there is something on the impeller or housing causing the pump to work too hard.
    Looks like I will be taking the afternoon off now as well.  I hope it's just something in the impeller or I am not going to sleep well at night.
    Anyone have a battery-backup air pump or know where I can get one ASAP?  Can't afford another incident.
     
  2. PotRoast

    PotRoast Well-Known ReefKeeper

    999
    Ratings:
    +24 / 0 / -0
    So what killed the fish?

    I have a x4 vortices on battery backup for 18 hours.

    But the air.....nobody has ever given me a good answer on whether you need air if you have your pumps on battery backup.

    I assume yes, you do need air but most people say the vortices are enough...

    Finally look into a PennPlax B-11 air pump.
     
  3. Bud Loves Bacon Website Team Board of Directors Leadership Team GIRS Member Vendor

    West Des Moines, IA
    Ratings:
    +1,823 / 14 / -0
    I'm guessing lack of O2. Seeing as the clowns were at the surface on their side gasping for air. The Tangs seemed to take the brunt of damage, the 2 smallest ones died, the Yellow was nearing death, and the Blue seemed fine as I'm guessing that organs shutting down based on size, smallest first?

    Also all the starfish (big brittle stars and baby stars) were all out and about and looking dead, as soon as flow returned they perked right up I guess. One of the peppermint shrimps was out and dead, another was hanging out on the big Monti Cap and looked fine.

    I googled x4 vortices and I cannot figure out what you are referring to.

    I'm assuming that water flow at the surface is all that really matters here. Air pump creates that and will at least keep O2 at high enough levels to maintain survival until the temp drops out.

    Oh yeah the temp was about 75 when I got there and about 76.5 when I left 1.5 hrs later so there was probably a drop below 75 which isn't too bad.

    The other thing I considered is that there is another receptacle above the tank which is not downstream from the one below and I could put a powerhead on that one, then if the bottom one trips at least there will be circulation. Then the full-building outage is the condition that would need battery backup.
     
  4. PotRoast

    PotRoast Well-Known ReefKeeper

    999
    Ratings:
    +24 / 0 / -0
    the spell checker on this site is annoying....

    vortices I mean VORTECH.

     
  5. Bud Loves Bacon Website Team Board of Directors Leadership Team GIRS Member Vendor

    West Des Moines, IA
    Ratings:
    +1,823 / 14 / -0
    That's what I wondered. What kind of battery backup do you have? When you say x4 do you mean an MP40?

    FYI on my tank at home I run just 3 Koralia's and nothing else and I have no oxygenation problems so your solution should be fine (i.e. no airstone needed)
     
  6. PotRoast

    PotRoast Well-Known ReefKeeper

    999
    Ratings:
    +24 / 0 / -0
    You can buy battery backups for a vortech. One backup will run one pump 36 hours or two pumps 18 hours.

    I have two battery backups meaning I have 18 hours of pump time......I run x4 MP40 vortech.

     
  7. adampottebaum

    adampottebaum Experienced Reefkeeper

    Ratings:
    +19 / 0 / -0
    There's no sure answer to the question if you need an air pump with battery backup pumps, it all depends on the pumps ability to "add" air to the tank. Vortechs are good pumps, but they only move water horizontally and don't provide as good surface agitation to increase dissolved oxygen as some other power heads. Also, there are air pumps that get plugged in that only turn on with loss of power, they are pretty cheap.
    As for a return pump, if you can't find one right away to get by until you figure out the Reeflo, I've used a Maxi-Jet 1200 for a return pump on my first 72 gallon reef tank. Stick an air stone in there and the MJ can get you by, but your best bet is to find a pump with comparable gph rating that can be swapped out.
    Good luck!
     
  8. BigB

    BigB Well-Known ReefKeeper

    422
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0
    A few years ago we had a big storm move through and knock power out for about 5 days, I didnt have a generator a battery backup.. Im not sure how I didnt lose any fish and only 1 coral but all I did everyday was pump air in the tank with a hand pump hooked onto an air stone then used some piece of plastic to move the water back and forth, I did that alot though out the day since my work was closed due to no power as well.. So I would say air and water movement are pretty important
    BTW Sorry about your lose..
     
  9. Brandon9400

    Brandon9400

    233
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0
    OH man that sucks sorry for your loss...maybe you could add an apex into your builds budget, so they can alarm you when power is out. That way you would be able to run over to the customers place and get the issue figured out ASAP.

    It is surface agitaion and oxygen that keeps the tank alive. I had power out for 12 hours and all's I did was scoop up water with a cup and drump it back in the tank for 5 min at a time every hour or so. I didn't have any fish or coral loss, hell they didn't even look stressed. Good luck!
     
  10. Bud Loves Bacon Website Team Board of Directors Leadership Team GIRS Member Vendor

    West Des Moines, IA
    Ratings:
    +1,823 / 14 / -0
    Last night I took the pump apart and there was nothing clogging it. Talked to Reeflo again and they said it's the chicken and the egg. There could have been a surge that caused the GFCI to trip and one or the other caused damage to the motor, which is why it is now overheating. Or, something could have gone wrong with the motor which caused the thermal overload to trip, which in turn caused the GFCI to trip. At this point, impossible to tell. So they're going to replace it.

    In the meantime, I determined by using 2 receptacle testers that the receptacle above the tank, which is also GFCI, operates independent of the one below the tank - neither of them trip each other. So I scraped some coralline off the back of the tank (which is almost 2mm thick in only 6 months!!!) and put a power head in there and zip-tied the power cord to the plenum (since the glass is so thick) and put it on that outlet. Then I found a receptacle on the wall by the tank that was not GFCI protected and plugged the Reeflo into that. So now, if the Reeflo trips itself out due to thermal overload, the power head in the tank will still run, keeping water moving well across the surface. Then, when the motor cools off, it should in theory ("usually" is what Chris @ reeflo said) kick back on.

    So that's how I have it set up now, then I'm going to pick up a spare pump from Matt N hopefully today and swap them out until I get the replacement pump. That will give me peace of mind if nothing else.

    All the remaining fish are still alive, eating, and doing well.
     
  11. MJB Tanks Well-Known ReefKeeper

    309
    Pleasant Hill, IA
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Bud, remember I told you my Reeflo Snapper crapped out a couple weeks ago? Sounds like your Reeflo just did the same thing...if I leave it plugged in it makes a whooshing sound almost like a flush and repeatedly does it. Housing gets pretty hot to the touch...I'm assuming the bearings are shot.
     

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