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Help!! SPS starting to RTN

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Fence13, Jan 22, 2017.

  1. Fence13 Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines
    Ratings:
    +300 / 1 / -0
    So yesterday I noticed that two of my SPS corals (Strawberry Shortcake, and Red Dragon) had suddenly RTN'd by 90% and 50% respectively. My green slimer is showing spots of pale color but maybe only 5% total. I immediately tested my tank water and got the following:

    Mg - 1050 (very low)
    Alk - 6.4 DKH (tank normally runs about 7ish)
    Ca - 325 (tank normally runs about 375)
    NO3 - 1ppm

    So yesterday, I added 100ml of ESV's Magnesium supplement to the tank, and started Mg to be dosed daily at 5ml/day. I also cleaned out my reservoir for CA and ALK solution as the ALK was some looking cloudy and slightly brown. Once dry, I then replaced this with new solutions.

    Today both corals were 100% white, and a jedi mind trick monti was looking very faded. When I retested I got this:

    Mg - 1020
    Alk - 8.3
    Ca - 370
    NO3 - 2.5ppm

    From what I understand, the Mg I added yesterday allowed my CA and ALK to climb prior to being depleted/absorbed. For fear of another big swing in CA and ALK, I've dropped my dosing unit to do 1ml of CA and ALK 4 times a day and I'll continue to dose the Mg by hand until the levels rise back up to at least 1200.

    I haven't added anything new to the tank, changed any husbandry or salt brands. The only thing I did was cut back some green slimer and birdsnest last weekend.

    Posting here for thoughts or suggestions that maybe I didn't think of? I'm under the current working impression that if I can get my levels to stabilize out that the rest of my SPS coral will be fine. Right?
     
  2. Dave Experienced Reefkeeper GIRS Member

    Des Moines Area
    Ratings:
    +450 / 1 / -0
    I suspect Alk might be the issue. That is a pretty big swing in one day and corals don't like that one to change much. We lost a number of corals when our kalk top off stuck on and alk shot up (even more than yours did). I agree, if you get it stable they "should" pull through if they are still alive. IF some you really like are R/STNing you might frag one and put in another tank as insurance. Good luck it sucks.

    Must be the day for tank disasters. We (think) we had a sea cucumber get sucked into skimmer pump and we lost almost all of our fish. Devastating.
     
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  3. beckerj3 Expert Reefkeeper Board of Directors Leadership Team GIRS Member

    West Des Moines, IA
    Ratings:
    +610 / 2 / -0
    Chris - good luck with the rest of your corals.

    Dave - how awful!!!!!!
     
  4. jeremy Acro Addict

    Davenport, IA
    Ratings:
    +836 / 4 / -0
    Sounds like your on the right track. You may have more pissed corals over the next week or so.

    I am guessing the low magnesium started it all and the alkalinity swing finished off anything that was stressed.

    It is recommended to only raise MG 100ppm/day, dkh .5/day and calcium I can't remember but thinking 50ppm/day.

    I had same problem and nuked my whole tank. I had a few other factors added to it but pretty much same situation but my alkalinity went from 7 to 9.8 and my tank is urns. So anything over 8.5 and I have tissue loss.
    Take it slow. Get your Alk a little over 7 your calcium 380ish and MG 1250 or more and see if you can keep it stable.
    Hopefully only good things from here. Good luck. Keep us posted.

    Was tissue loss from the base then spread or just patches of flesh peeling from all over?

    Can you test po4?
     
  5. Fence13 Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines
    Ratings:
    +300 / 1 / -0
    @jeremy@jeremy I think the tank had unused alk just sitting there, and when I dosed the Mg it allowed the Alk to spike up. I would concur about the Alk swing killing off the struggling pieces.

    The tissue loss was too sudden to see if it was from the base, but when a portion pieces were still alive it was more like the branches died first then the base.

    Haven't tested PO4, I had been out of solution for my hanna checker, but I did order more, it is on the way now.
     
  6. Actuary Well-Known ReefKeeper

    705
    Adel, IA
    Ratings:
    +145 / 1 / -0
    I'm so sorry to hear that... That's terrible news. Was this on your 300g DD or the 200g (or 220?) in-wall?
     
  7. Dave Experienced Reefkeeper GIRS Member

    Des Moines Area
    Ratings:
    +450 / 1 / -0
    300. Two clowns and mandarin are the only survivors.
     
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  8. Actuary Well-Known ReefKeeper

    705
    Adel, IA
    Ratings:
    +145 / 1 / -0
    Dang that makes me feel sick! That was such a beautiful naso.. and powder blue. Bleh.
     
  9. FishBrain Expert Reefkeeper GIRS Member

    New London
    Ratings:
    +397 / 6 / -0
    How the tank looking now Chris?
     
  10. Fence13 Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines
    Ratings:
    +300 / 1 / -0
    So the corals are for the most part okay. The green slimer still has some spots, but the polyps are still bright green even though the bone has gone white. I'm hoping that it will fill back in with color and not die off.

    Tests for 1/23:
    Mg 1005
    Alk 7.5
    Ca 360
    NO3 2.5ppm

    Then on 1/24
    Mg 1005
    Alk 7.7
    Ca 325
    NO3 1ppm

    Both days I was adding Mg doses to the tank but no other doses. After my Calcium started dropping I turned my doser on for that a lone to push 20ml per day. I'll see what effect it had when I get home today and test again. Still haven't dosed my Alk as I'm sure the tank is perhaps a little saturated still.
     
  11. Actuary Well-Known ReefKeeper

    705
    Adel, IA
    Ratings:
    +145 / 1 / -0
    Have you checked your salinity with a calibrated refractometer? I'm stunned you were able to get all of your levels that low.
     
  12. Fence13 Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines
    Ratings:
    +300 / 1 / -0
    Actually thanks. I was so caught up in the RTN issue that I didn't think about calibrating. My salinity was actually way low. So now I'm going to be doing a lot of little water changes to bring that back up....slowly.

    Also added a salinity meter for my apex to the list
     
  13. beckerj3 Expert Reefkeeper Board of Directors Leadership Team GIRS Member

    West Des Moines, IA
    Ratings:
    +610 / 2 / -0
    Another thing to consider is to use salt water for your top-off water - until you get salinity back to where you want it to be. The salt water could even be at a slightly higher salinity. This would slowly increase your salinity as well as increase your calc, alk, and mg levels.
     
  14. Actuary Well-Known ReefKeeper

    705
    Adel, IA
    Ratings:
    +145 / 1 / -0
    Was your salinity around 27 ppt by any chance? That's roughly the salinity that your Ca and Mg would be lined up with. Makes things a little easier if you don't have to raise salinity while also calibrating certain parameters.
     
  15. Fence13 Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines
    Ratings:
    +300 / 1 / -0
    I left my notes at the house but I think it was down around there.
     
  16. Kungpaoshizi Well-Known ReefKeeper

    561
    davenport
    Ratings:
    +39 / 1 / -0
    Conductivity probes are worthless imo. I too would look to bump the alk a little higher, though I would like to know the po4. I recently kept track of my tank over a few months and noticed it hits 6 for alk since I've been slacking on tests. It was looking just fine though, that's what made me wonder. But after bumping the alk up 1-2 dkh in a day or two, I still had some necrosis on one specimen.

    One thing I always do if I ever notice necrosis is feed extra everyday with nutricell. You could probably use any particulate, but this is encapsulated. Coating the corals in food seems to help halting or at least easing the stress, whatever it may be. But also do a very slow in/out with a water change over the period of a few days will help deal with the extra food.

    In hindsight, as I've been doing more testing with the tank looking great, I noticed 6-7 dkh and .1 po4 on a regular basis. Minimal algae still, but colors have faded just a tad. But of course the alk would tank (ba dun ching!) if there was a catastrophic event of some sort.
     
  17. Fence13 Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines
    Ratings:
    +300 / 1 / -0
    PO4 test kit came in yesterday, so it gets added to the list of things to test for tonight!
     
  18. blackx-runner Administrator Website Team Leadership Team

    Cedar Rapids, IA
    Ratings:
    +738 / 5 / -0
    Sounds like you're tracking down your issue, but because it was mentioned in another thread I'm going to throw stray voltage into the discussion.
     
  19. Fence13 Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines
    Ratings:
    +300 / 1 / -0
    PO4 was 0.14ppm for the record!
     
  20. jeremy Acro Addict

    Davenport, IA
    Ratings:
    +836 / 4 / -0
    With po4 being on the high side you may want your alkalinity up around 9.
     

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