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Advice? Gfo or biopellets

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by jayt, Apr 12, 2016.

  1. jayt Well-Known ReefKeeper

    329
    Harpers Ferry, IA
    Ratings:
    +23 / 0 / -0
    What do you use or suggest. What brands have you had success with. Tips and suggestions for using said product. Thanks
     
  2. blackx-runner Administrator Website Team Leadership Team

    Cedar Rapids, IA
    Ratings:
    +738 / 5 / -0
    Depends on the primary function you are looking for.
    If you mainly need nitrate control biopellets will do the job better. Yes they will reduce phosphates, but very limited amounts. If you're mainly looking for something for phosphates GFO or another phosphate absorbing media will be best.
    I ran both. I have now switched to vinegar as my carbon source though. No specific reason for the switch besides breaking my biopellet reactor. Still run GFO to control phosphates.
     
  3. jayt Well-Known ReefKeeper

    329
    Harpers Ferry, IA
    Ratings:
    +23 / 0 / -0
    I've been fighting phosphates since I setup up my current tank. Fuge, scrubber and gfo, can't get them under control.
     
  4. Roman Experienced Reefkeeper

    Cedar Rapids, IA
    Ratings:
    +321 / 3 / -0
    They now have all in one bio pellets with Gfo in it at at bulk reef supply that I was going to try .
     
  5. jayt Well-Known ReefKeeper

    329
    Harpers Ferry, IA
    Ratings:
    +23 / 0 / -0
    I seen those and want to try them but some of the reviews make me questions them a little bit.
     
  6. jeremy Acro Addict

    Davenport, IA
    Ratings:
    +836 / 4 / -0
    If you don't have problems with nitrates, biopellets won't be any help. They don't lower phosphate very much if at all especially if your system is low nitrates.
    You must have phosphate bound up somewhere in your system. Either your rocks or sand or both. It's gonna take time to get those out. Gfo will exaust quickly with high readings. You may need to change weekly until you levels come down. They make liquid phosphate removers that may help. I haven't used them so can't comment on which to use but probably cheaper than Gfo until your levels are lower.
    Just don't go from .2 or whatever to 0.00 overnight. Your corals will be pissed.
    You may have to lighten feedings, clean sump, blow detritus from behind rocks, and step up water changes to multiple times a week.
    I ran biopellets for 3 years. Worked well for nitrates but was 0 nitrate all the time. And my coral colors suffered. I got rid of the pellets and cut back the amount of Gfo used and run a scrubber. Now I run .02-.07 phosphate. I change media when readings are .07. And my nitrates run 2-4ppm. Coral colors are much better.
    If you are dosing amino acids stop and cut back feedings. And if feed frozen, rinse in Rodi before feeding.
    Is your scrubber properly sized?
     
  7. jayt Well-Known ReefKeeper

    329
    Harpers Ferry, IA
    Ratings:
    +23 / 0 / -0
    Testing shows 0 nitrates, just having issues with phosphates is all. I picked up an older version of one of turbos units about a month ago and so far am having a hard time getting it seeded, hopefully I can cut back on gfo once it gets going. I don't dose any amino acids but am going to cut back on feeding. I only feed frozen once a week.
     
  8. jeremy Acro Addict

    Davenport, IA
    Ratings:
    +836 / 4 / -0
    Sounds like your on the right track. If you need help with your scrubber contact @Turbo's Aquatics@Turbo's Aquatics he will help you out. It takes some time to get the screen going but should help once it's going.
    With 0 nitrates don't bother with pellets. Not worth the extra equipment or hassle. They have their place but don't sound like you need it.
     
  9. jeremy Acro Addict

    Davenport, IA
    Ratings:
    +836 / 4 / -0
    Just out of curiosity, when you say high phosphate, what is your reading and test kit your using? Any nuisance algaes?
     
  10. Kungpaoshizi Well-Known ReefKeeper

    561
    davenport
    Ratings:
    +39 / 1 / -0
    After fully embracing the red sea stuff, don't think I'll ever try anything else. But nopox has to be used with reef energy. Then if you have a phosphate imbalance, increase the RE being dosed. And ya, I'vetried so much it was crazy
     
  11. jayt Well-Known ReefKeeper

    329
    Harpers Ferry, IA
    Ratings:
    +23 / 0 / -0
    I have already spoken with turbo and has been a world of help. Thanks again turbo. I'm using the regular hannah checker, not the ultra low, have been running between .2 and .4 I have just a tiny bit of algea growing in my overflows, otherwise none in my dt. Was thinking possibly the all in one biopellets that way I don't necessarily have to worry about changing media so much. And brs is currently out of gfo again so I was looking for a different option.
     
  12. jeremy Acro Addict

    Davenport, IA
    Ratings:
    +836 / 4 / -0
    Be careful. Pellets can bring on a bunch if problems to if not used properly.
    I have no experience with all in one pellets. Hopefully they work well for you.
     
  13. jayt Well-Known ReefKeeper

    329
    Harpers Ferry, IA
    Ratings:
    +23 / 0 / -0
    I have quite decided if I'm going to use them or not. It'll probably depend if brs has any gfo in stock when I run out. I do know to start with a very small amount and have read some about them starving the tank of oxygen.
     
  14. jeremy Acro Addict

    Davenport, IA
    Ratings:
    +836 / 4 / -0
    Yup. Can suck oxygen out. Make sure you run effluent from pellet reactor directly into skimmer intake or right next to it. Start slow. Can cause cyano problems also.
     
  15. jeremy Acro Addict

    Davenport, IA
    Ratings:
    +836 / 4 / -0
    Honestly. If it was me. I wouldn't run them. I have and won't do it again. They strip too much out of the water. It's hard to get the amount dialed in. That and another reactor cluttering your sump space and a feed pump.
    I just run small amounts of carbon and gfo, a large skimmer, turbo algae scrubber and regular water changes.
    On my other tank just a small skimmer and regular water changes. I have found through trial and error simple is way better and easier. Not saying a lot of equipment is bad just over complicated.
    Of course this is just my experience. People do different things with great results also.
     
  16. jayt Well-Known ReefKeeper

    329
    Harpers Ferry, IA
    Ratings:
    +23 / 0 / -0
    I was just going to take the gfo out of my reactor and replace with biopellets. But they are starting to sound like a major pita.
     
  17. blackx-runner Administrator Website Team Leadership Team

    Cedar Rapids, IA
    Ratings:
    +738 / 5 / -0
    What are your current nitrate levels and what are you doing to control them?
    If you're strictly having issues with phosophates I would take a guess that you have a lot of excess that's bound up in your sand and rock and its just constantly leaching out. Could be something like the water source, or storage container too that's adding to it. High levels are going to eat through GFO pretty rapidly. When you change GFO do you see much of a drop in your phosphate levels?

    Most of the "natural" process using a carbon source or growing algae are going to do very little for phosphates because you are probably nitrate limited. There is some magic ratio of carbon to nitrate to phosphate that is needed for things to occur "naturally". Or something along those lines. I've read about it in articles, but I typically loose focus on the in depth content of those after the second paragraph because they get so technical, so I may be off a little.
    Anyway it's necessary for a lot of reefers to utilize some kind phosphate absorbing media.

    I finally have gotten my phosphate levels back to reasonable numbers and it took a LOT of GFO. I bought the cheap stuff on ebay because for my purposes it was a cheaper alternative than BRS stuff. Once the levels are reasonably low I think the BRS stuff is a lot better, and better quality too.

    300+ gallon system I would change GFO and monitor the phosphate levels closely. I would get a small decline and level out again. My GFO was exhausted in probably a couple days when I started this cleanup. Went to a larger reactor running a pound of GFO at a time and I could go a little longer. I just continued the cycle of monitoring and changing GFO and eventually it started coming down at a decent rate. Now I'm .02-.04 and holding pretty good around there. Once it starts to go above that I change GFO. My 1 pound of cheap GFO lasts about a month currently.
     
  18. jayt Well-Known ReefKeeper

    329
    Harpers Ferry, IA
    Ratings:
    +23 / 0 / -0
    Testing with api nitrate has always been 0, I have tested my ro just to make sure I wasn't adding anything that way. Tested all 0's. Strictly having phosphate issue, though it could have been my rock leaching out but since I had the tank up and cycled I didn't want to pull the rock and start over, was getting anxious to get my critters moved. Probably a bad call on my behalf. Would it be a good idea to try and dose nitrates somehow to help with my scrubber and such? I'll just have to start changing it on the regular just incase it goes bad during the week while I'm gone and leaches into the system. Guess I better buy the big bucket next time, who knows how long things might leach if that's my case. Never intended for this post to be about my system, was just kinda looking for general information for myself and others. Thanks for the help everyone.
     
  19. jeremy Acro Addict

    Davenport, IA
    Ratings:
    +836 / 4 / -0
    I am not saying dont run biopellets. Just do alot of research first. I just feel that in your case it is not needed. like @blackx-runner@blackx-runner said your going to go through alot of media to get it out. I did the same thing. My rock had alot bound up too. It took a while to get it under control. Sometimes media would last a couple days then after awhile a couple weeks and now 5 or 6 weeks and i only run around 2/3 a cup on roughly 200 gallons. I am trying to get rid of it all together but have to go slow with a tank full of finniky SPS.
    I think pellets are good to use in systems with a ton of fish and alot of food added. Just make sure go slow like 1/3 dose for 3 weeks and maybe go about 1/2 the amount and give them 8 weeks to culture and you will start to see results. Just skim the hell out of the effluent or you will have bacterial blooms. adjust your pellet amount to run the nitrates you want just dont zero or you will starve your corals and throw your nitrate/phosphate ratio out of balance and it will be hard to reduce phosphate. like david said if your nitrate limited its hard to reduce po4.
    There are write ups on Reef Central and Reef2reef and many other forums if you want some boring reading material. but its helpful and good to know.
     
  20. jayt Well-Known ReefKeeper

    329
    Harpers Ferry, IA
    Ratings:
    +23 / 0 / -0
    Actually just read a nice thread about nitrate dosing on reef central , i think I'm going to give that a try.
     

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